Selling My Car Taught Me That Greedy Pigs Do Indeed Get Slaughtered

"Torque Affair" (torqueaffair)
07/19/2015 at 11:50 • Filed to: CAR SELLING

I should have known better. I cleaned up my car so nicely that it looked amazing – well at least as amazing as it could have looked given the fact that it was an 8.5 year old car with 115K miles on it that was, let’s just say, heavily enjoyed . Because I was in my own dreamland, I was hoping to obtain a ridiculously high sale price.

I’ve sold my cars for good prices before so I figured I could sell my 2007 Mustang for a premium. All I really needed to do was keep waxing and polishing until my arms fell off. Not everything on the car was perfect but at 115K miles you would certainly expect quite a bit of wear and tear. I think you will agree that my back-breaking detailing work turned out pretty well!

To kick off my car-selling process, I first went to Carmax because I’ve gone there before and we all know that they generally offer you one of the lower prices around – at least that’s what I thought at the time. With my first trip to Carmax with the Mustang, I got an offer for $8K. Going by my previous experience, I immediately assumed, “Oh, if Carmax is offering me $8K, I could easily get $10K from somewhere else”.

Boy, was I wrong.

So, next, I proceeded to list my car on Craigslist and virtually no one emailed me inquiring about it. No matter how many times I refreshed my email during the day, I didn’t get any responses at all. It was so disappointing. After a couple weeks of reposting, I finally got a lowball offer of $8K which I completely ignored.

After a while, reality set in, and I reduced the listing price to $10K with still no interest. At this point, I considered going to dealers to see if they could offer something closer to $10K than $8K. What you’re witnessing here is the slow torture that is inflicted on someone who is being a greedy pig.

Then something terrible happened – my alternator conked out. $600 later I was starting to regret the fact that I didn’t take Carmax’s offer. This is what happens when you don’t get slaughtered right away – it is like having your limbs chopped off slowly. “Oh yea, you want more money? Well how about I cut off your pinky finger?”

So I went around to other places with a missing pinky finger hoping that perhaps someone would offer me more than $8K. Not a chance.

After my car was fixed up, I put it up for sale again for $10K when someone emailed with an offer for $9K. I should’ve jumped on it but I was still being greedy and so I thought that I would miraculously find someone to pay me $10K for the car.

After a few more weeks, I started going around to a couple other dealers to get quotes and I found that the prices started dropping. I was mortified. Now I was getting quotes that were in the $7K range. What?!?

I couldn’t believe that in a month prices dropped so much. Hardly any time passed by before the market started tanking for my car. Everywhere I went I was being offered $7K, $6891, $6900 and so I went to Autohero as a last ditch effort and patiently waited for my quote. The guy was taking paint measurements (to see if it was repainted), and did way more analysis than the car deserved. I crossed my fingers and hoped that somehow his iPad would come back with a higher value.

It was $6800. Noooo!!!

I heard from a couple places that a few of the modifications I had made dropped the value which makes sense. I knew this was going to happen and so I will make it a point to never modify my cars again so that I can get rid of them quickly at a good value.

Even Carmax was now offering me $7K instead of the previous offer of $8K – I was demoralized. This taught me an important lesson - most dealers will essentially offer you about the same price for your car except for one.

These guys were willing to offer me $500 over my Carmax offer.

Now because I had posted so much on Craigslist, perhaps people pegged me as the desperate one and didn’t bother responding to my ad. In the end, I had no choice but to swallow my pride and sell my car for $7500. I suppose I could’ve kept my car for longer but then again I didn’t want to hold onto the car anymore and run the risk of having to pay for more unexpected repairs. I just really wanted to get rid of it and spend the money on a !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! .

Yes, folks, greedy pigs do indeed get slaughtered. Lesson learned!

!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

!!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! is about exploring my fascination with cars; I’m always on the lookout for things that interest me in the car world. Like !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! and follow !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! !

DISCUSSION (100)

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 11:52

Interesting. Carmax offered us $5500 for our car. We sold it for $8000.

M. Christopher McFann > sm70- why not Duesenberg?
07/19/2015 at 12:27

The issue was it’s a Mustang.

RallyWrench > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 12:28

I wouldn’t swear off modding, maybe just avoid major surgery and keep the stock parts.

boxrocket > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 12:45

When I sold my Volvo in April, I started it at $3500, and bounced it down as low as $2000, and finally sold it for $3000 after a few offers, no shows, and countless texts and emails. CarMax offered me $200, which was easily $250 less than scrap value, which was almost insulting, though they do have to pay to get it moved to the auction(s) and listed and such.

That sucks about the fallen value. I guess the new Mustang’s availability pushed older models down in price?

SlickMcRick > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 12:48

How much were you trying to sell it on CL before you dropped the price to $10k?

jjhats > M. Christopher McFann
07/19/2015 at 13:03

I think you misspelled ford

Iwaswonderofwonders > RallyWrench
07/19/2015 at 13:14

Rule One: Do not buy another man’s project.

datsteve > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 13:20

Price comfortably and ideally and sell as fast as you can. 8k in pocket is far better than the 10k you wanna make but can’t.

jalop1991 > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 13:21

It’s “pigs get fat, hogs get slaughtered”.

Driver > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 13:22

I quit reading here:

“After my car was fixed up, I put it up for sale again for $10K when someone emailed with an offer for $9K. I should’ve jumped on it but I was still being greedy and so I thought that I would miraculously find someone to pay me $10K for the car.”

Tina Corbett > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 13:27

I do the AutoTrader thing at my dealership and most people greatly over value your car.

1) You’re selling it for a reason.

2) Learn to look at your car the way a stranger would. Emotions are your worst friend here.

3) Forget Blue Book. And if you do use KBB, your car is NOT in excellent condition. It just isn’t. If it’s used...it’s NOT in excellent condition. Repeat after me. I don’t care how often you wash it and baby it. Excellent means NO paint wear, NO scratches. None. Not even that tiny one you have to squint to see on the rear panel. All new matched tires and a pristine interior..ie...a new car.

4) If everyone is offering you $5,000 for a car that you think is worth $8000, your car is only worth $5,000. Take the offer! All the KBB, AutoTrader, Carmax and CL prices mean nothing if people are only willing to pay a certain amount. Your car is only worth what people are willing to pay for it. Not what you paid for it, not what a computer says, not what your buddy says, and NOT what you ‘put into it’.

Adam Panzica > M. Christopher McFann
07/19/2015 at 13:29

Indeed. Why buy a 8.5 year old car with 115K miles when you can lease a much, much, MUCH better 2015 mustang that will get nearly twice the fuel milage, actually be able to go around turns, have a warranty, and not feel like the interior was made of legos, for approximately the same total cost? It’s like the reverse of a Tavarish post.

LionelHutz > boxrocket
07/19/2015 at 13:29

Can I ask what make and model Volvo? I have a 99 S70 GLT approaching 200k that does much more sitting than moving and was thinking of moving it. My Volvo mechanic says start at 3500.

Sjubbdubb > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 13:31

So after realizing that depreciation is harsh, you went on to buy a BMW?

Quade > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 13:31

Carmax offered me $3k More for my F150 than any dealer did. Toyota sales guy followed me to Carmax, I sold it to them, then they drove me back to the Toyota dealer where I bought a Tundra.

With Carmax, it depends on how desirable the vehicle is. If it’s fairly new and low miles, they typically offer better pricing than the dealer. It’s it’s an 9 year old like this mustang, I’m not surprised it was just an average price. Their prices seem to drop off faster than other places.

Pistons of Fury > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 13:33

Mods are counter-intuitive. While they cost money and technically should increase the value of the car, they in fact do the opposite. Next time just keep your stock parts, including the wheels/tires and put them all back on when it’s time to sell. The buyer will see a perfectly stock car that appears to have never been hooned, and as a bonus you get to sell the mod parts by themselves on Craigslist. Win-win.

Sean Hoover > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 13:35

What were the mods? Friend purchased a 2007 with 80K from a dealer for 8500.00 So unless you had melted gold bars into the door sills, you were way too far off the mark to begin with...

Ganthrithor > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 13:36

Pricing cars isn’t that hard: look on Autotrader, Cars.com, and Craigslist. Get a feel for the market, and know your comparables (if your regional market is flooded with similar cars, you’re gonna have to list it for less; if there are two other similar cars for sale within 750 miles of you, and yours is nicer than the other two, you’re in a stronger position). Come up with an honest / realistic price for the car, then add a bit to that to use as a negotiating buffer (everyone’s going to want to feel like a haggle-hero, so why not plan on satifying their ego from the get-go), then list the car at that price.

Danger > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 13:36

Haha you should have modded it more to add more value

wlb50 > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 13:37

“The Bears make money and the Bulls make money but the pigs never do”

———Old Wall Street Saying

I wouldn’t exactly place your situation in the “pig” category but you viewed your car differently from how a potential buyer viewed your car. To you it was a treasured possession; to a buyer who really didn’t know your car it was a commodity.

Remember too there is wholesale - what Carmax was offering, and retail - the top price of a car. Generally IMO anyway a private party sale should be somewhere between wholesale and retail.

il buono > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 13:38

I learned this lesson after selling a smartphone. I’m a smartphone addict so I tend to buy/sell them fairly often as soon as a new flagship gets released. I priced the phone a little higher than average since it was in like new condition and came with a lot of accessories. I got the obvious low ball offers quickly and just ignored them. Other offers came in a little higher, but I was stubborn and felt like my device was worth what I was asking for. Time passed and the average price started to dip. People start seeing it’s an old post and the it no longer generates interest. The phone ended up selling for less than one of the offers I got before. Lesson learned. From that day on, I’ve now been more flexible on the price and try my best to work with the potential buyer’s offer.

 > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 13:38

If you want to sell your car quickly you will never get a good price. If you want to get a good price you have to sit on it until you find someone who wants your car and is willing to pay for it.

gravit8 > Tina Corbett
07/19/2015 at 13:41

People also forget regional differences in demand and real-world functionality - KBB is ‘average’ value in the market, so a convertible sports car like an S2000 isn’t exactly going to fetch as much in some remote mountain town as it might in a place like LA or Miami. And then there’s the little bubbles, like Vermont and NH, where Subaru is king and despite heavy availability they get higher resale values (generally) than they would in the rest of the country. You really need to put some thought into it but we’re car people so it’s easy for us. Most of the pleebs can’t grasp the fact that their ‘pristine’ ‘94 Civic isn’t worth $10k no matter how many coats of wax they have a detailer apply (because you know they haven’t waxed it for the entire time they’ve owned it).

Tina Corbett > gravit8
07/19/2015 at 13:43

True. However more and more ‘valuation’ apps are asking for zip codes now so that’s helping.

Leberschnitzel > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 13:43

Recently wanted to go all Train and Bus (moved to Switzerland, it really works here) and wanted to sell my Honda Civic Type R from 2008 for 10k.
There where many other cars the same type with the same KM around the internet for more money. And mine was original all over, including nice new rims.
But no one wanted it. Literally no one.
I got one offer for 7k, but I wrote back that I had another price in mind, if 9’500 would be nicer, but never got replied back.
Short time after it I had a small accident where I ripped of my front bumper, oversaw a little metal stick in the ground while parking sideways. it was 1’850chf to fix it.
After that I thought: Fuck it, I keep the car, put it on the lowest possible insurance and keep it parked in my garage for when I need it.

boxrocket > LionelHutz
07/19/2015 at 13:44

1990 760 Turbo wagon that had 174K on original powertrain, accident-free, and I was the second non-dealer owner.

kis_ev > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 13:47

I think a quick and simple way to determine if you think an offer is fair is whether or not you would accept the deal if you were on the other end of it. What you have paid $10K for your car or would you have thought $8K as a fair price? I’ve been trading stocks for half of my life and have learned early on that you have to take the emotional connection of trades; otherwise you will have regrets, make poor judgments, and you won’t earn the respect of the other parties involved.

I’m rather attached to my used 01 VW Golf TDI GLS 5-speed that I know I could never sell it.

St4rbeast > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 13:47

I’m glad to see some reaffirmation that the badly priced cars on CL aren’t selling, but overall I don’t think 10k is SOO greedy for a (2006?) Mustang GT. I see a lot of these with ~15k asking price. Maybe its time I go lowball a few mustangs...

ex313 > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 13:48

I am shopping for a S197 convertible right now, and most dealers are asking crazy money for these cars. Seems to be a huge gap between wholesale and retail right now.

MTY19855 > gravit8
07/19/2015 at 13:48

But to counter that demand, LA and Miami are going to have a lot more convertibles on the market in the first place.

Mambo-Dave > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 13:49

God I hate people like this seller (and, now, writer that I don’t like). I made, no lie, over 100 calls, and visited 40 cars before buying my used daily driver outside a few months ago. A fair vehicle for a fair price was all I wanted, and I was even flexible on which type of vehicle it could be (I looked at domestic cars, pickup trucks, and finally foreign cars before finally buying a foreign car... never in my wildest dreams would I ever have thought I’d end up with a Hyundai for a second car, but the market was so full of fools and crooks, I bought the first honest car I happened across after nearly two-months’ of searching).

Resolute Blue > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 13:51

I’m digging the new colors on the logo! What made y’all decide to change it?

Mr. Flareside > Tina Corbett
07/19/2015 at 13:53

Couldn’t have said it better myself.

Also to note: it doesn't increase the value Just because you cut your springs and put the wrong sized tires on your Civic.

Tina Corbett > LionelHutz
07/19/2015 at 13:56

Nope. With that many miles...$1500 to maybe $2750. Volvos are awesome though.

Mr. Flareside > Danger
07/19/2015 at 13:57

Realistically it doesn’t increase the value. But it might open up the possibilities of finding a buyer that is willing to overpay for the vehicle with the given Mods.

timgray > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 13:57

So many people think their car is, “pristine or Very good” no car over 100K is very good, the best you can get is an actual “good” where 90% of the cars live.

Unless the car looks showroom new inside outside, under it and even the engine compartment, it’s not anywhere near “very good” or higher.

Tina Corbett > Mr. Flareside
07/19/2015 at 14:02

Yep. This is where advertising on a car enthusiast forum would make sense.

Tina Corbett > Mr. Flareside
07/19/2015 at 14:05

Heh, I remember when I had to get rid of my 98 Taurus that had 308,000 miles on it. It was my baby, and I loved that car for many reasons.

BUT...it was still a POS Taurus, it just happened to be MY POS Taurus and if someone had offered me the amount that it was honestly worth..I’d have slapped them. :-)

I ended up giving it away.

Joan Barreda Borts 3rd Knee > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 14:06

Well sounds like you learned your lesson anyway.

On a side, something is worth what people will pay, as much as people think they can set their price for something, if nobody is willing to pay for it, it doesn’t matter.

Sure you can hold out for more, but generally if everyone’s offering around the same, I’ve always found its worth just accepting one of them.

5mtFXT > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 14:07

Kinja'd!!!

Terlingua wheels?

DougNuts > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 14:08

You win some, you lose some. I sold a 2007 Honda Accord to a coworker for what I thought was a fair price and then the used car market got so screwed up that I could have sold it for the same price 2 years later.

RazorGP > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 14:11

I got a no-wreck 07 mustang I used in college till now as a DD. It’s got a whopping 42k miles. It’s a fully optioned up coupe. I got an offer for $12k a year ago but wasn’t in a position to sell.

Now that I’m looking it seems I’m getting offers at 2/3rds that.

It's almost worth more totaled.

MooseKnuckles > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 14:11

Bought a 2007 Mazda6 5-door with 3.0 V6 for $12995 in 2010. Traded it in this past fall on my Silverado. Trade in value? $11500. Was originally going to sell to my neighbour for a fair $7500. I put 70000km on it in the time I owned it.
Dealership was a 3hr drive, but obviously well worth it.

Squid > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 14:12

I had an issue when I tried selling my sisters truck. It was a 2003 Tacoma TRD 4x4 that was fully loaded. We were reasonable with our valuation compared to the market. in SoCal those trucks consistantly get marked at around $15k so I thought I’d get a decent sale by listing at $12,500 and letting people know that I would negotiate on price and take the first $10k cash offer.

All I got were lowball offers of $7k and below with people bringing ads of “comparable” trucks that were 4 cylinder non 4x4 and without the factory TRD package. I also wrote the most clear listing I could that would tell people what it was about, all the maintenance and what was wrong with the front end(my sister smashed it on a sand dune and never got the front end fixed). After having the truck listed for a few weeks we pulled it off of craigslist and then let it sit for a bit and then re-listed it a while later and got the $10k we wanted for it.

In reality I should have just thrown my $7k I got for totalling my focus at my sister to take that truck. But Oh well.

Oh yeah we got it professionally detailed and all cleaned with the interior as clean as it could get and the exterior as clean and polished as it could get for a 10 year old truck that had 150k miles on it.

sailor venus > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 14:16

Carmax offered me $600 for my 2002 Beetle back in October. I had it detailed and sold it in November on craigslist for my asking price of $2000. I was shocked at the $600 offer. I laughed my way out of the dealership.

Blair > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 14:19

never be in a rush to sell ANYtHING!!! If you are then you are at a disadvantage

There are two things to note when selling cars.Most Buyers are cheap as hell and want something for nothing and sellers drastically over inflate the price and want the world for their car cause “it’s so amazing”

When buying and selling I never get too attached. If I’m buying and someone doesn’t accept my offer I thank them for their time and say goodbye never being a jerk. I once had a guy follow me home and accept my offer because I said no thanks to his price and was curtious. He said he had been dealing with so many jerks that were disrespectful for so long and that I knew what I was talking about.

Have Jeep, will travel. > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 14:19

“Excellent” condition usually only applies to garage queens newer than 5 years old with low mileage that literally looks like new and needs NO work.

I will go online and price out similar cars and base my price from there. NADA and KBB aren’t always accurate. Sometimes high, sometimes low.

Take a ton of good pictures. That will atleast get people to your door over the other cars that have 3 potato pics.

Mods DO NOT increase value. The town virgin is worth more than the town whore. Only exception is a Jeep Wrangler, and Toyota trucks/4runner/Land Cruiser. Thats about the only instance where mods raise value and they have to be legit like ARB lockers, Warn winches, etc.

chaos-cascade > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 14:19

That’s a good looking car for $7,500. In the end it just might be the used Mustang that kills the EG Civic crowd. I wouldn’t have called that. 15 years of innovation goes along way in the new American auto industry.

Jared Glentz > boxrocket
07/19/2015 at 14:22

ummmm in april scrap was at a decade all time low with the average price being $50 a ton which is what i was getting as well......so no

and its still way down i got $85 a ton last week

bmessina > boxrocket
07/19/2015 at 14:23

Ugh, I’m halfway shopping for that year/model right now. The ‘90 760 wagon is the pinnacle of that body style, including the 900 series, in my opinion.

chaos-cascade > gravit8
07/19/2015 at 14:23

Most folks asking $10k for their 94 Civic have 30k into it. They try to sell it on the forums and Craigslist for a month or two. Sometimes they get a buyer right off the bat especially if they have a detailed build thread with videos, dyno sheets etc... If it doesn’t sell in three months then they start parting it out and returning it to stock until someone does.

Comfortably Dumb > Danger
07/19/2015 at 14:29

I’ve never seen mods do anything but lose money

CitronC > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 14:32

When we recently traded in my wife’s car the values were quite varried. We didn’t have hearts set on specific make/model so could walk away. We got a range of $2500 difference before talking numbers, suffice to say the higher offer (right at KBB good to very good trade) ended up with the business as they were also more willing to play ball (the entire process took less time than another dealers courtship phase, we walked out when they went to get the “manager”). Much better than trading the Juke, pretty low offer, they listed it high, it was there for a while and price dropped steeply before selling after ~3 months, watching it sit and drop made me feel better about the low offer as I’d not have had time to mess around with lookers and negotiations for months while making a payment.

The Undecider > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 14:33

I’ve sold 2 vehicles to Henna Chevy for $500 over Carmax offer. They were the easiest transactions ever. The last vehicle I sold was my 16 year old Chevy truck. I knew it would be a challah ge selling something this old and preferences not to deal with Craigslist. The truck had the infamous Vortec V8 piston slap on cold startup which is more than likely harmless, but sounds like holy hell for about 30 seconds. The transmission had a hard 1-2 shift that was likely a shift solenoid sticking. Carmax offered me $4000 which kind of shocked me it was that much. I took it down to Henna the next day and they happily did the deal for $4500.

CitronC > gravit8
07/19/2015 at 14:40

Location is what killed my 6MT Juke trade, that category (the not a dedicated sports car MT category, MT Miatas and Mustangs sell easily in the area, less dedicated drivers don’t care to deal with traffic, hills, and a clutch) doesn’t do well in an area with traffic and hills.

Gixxer750 > Danger
07/19/2015 at 14:41

Mods usually drop the value actually

Krazeecain > SlickMcRick
07/19/2015 at 14:56

He’s probably too embarrassed to say now...

Kevin > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 14:59

Mustang GTs in my area not looking half as waxed as that one are going for 15,000 with 100k on the clock. V6s with ~100 get 7k or so

OneMoreTimeAgainandAgain > gravit8
07/19/2015 at 15:00

“ People also forget regional differences in demand ”. Even small distances can make a difference.

I was looking for a 2008 or later F150, with not many options. Something to haul crap from the lumber yard, and go camping in. New enough that I will hopefully get years of trouble free driving out of it.

I was about ready to pay $11,000 to $12,000 in the Bay Area, but I decided to try Sacramento - just 100 miles away. The $100 I spent on gas and a bottle of bourbon I bought for my friend who drove me there was well spent. I picked up one for under $8,000 - and it was exactly like the ones I’d been looking at for $12k.

spyderman4g63 >
07/19/2015 at 15:08

I highly doubt waiting will work on something as common as a mustang v6 though. Maybe if it’s some desirable model.

hackunamatata > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 15:08

I learned this lesson the hard way selling my grandma’s house. She wanted to move to a small 2 bedroom apartment, but tricky part was half of the house was owned by her two children - my dad and his twin sister. My dad does not care about the house at all, but his sister, who is living in the house for 40 years, never contributing to a single repair, not even blade replacement in the cheap lawn mower, was crazy greedy. So we put up the price that was way over the top, and what happened, even after the price was 20% down, nobody even called anymore because everybody assumed there is something wrong with the house. Same goes with cars. Unless it is something specific, it should be gone within 2 weeks. A Mustang here in Europe would be harder to sell but I assume in US that should be considered a common car.

Z06blake > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 15:09

I have learned that instead of selling your car privately and going through the whole Craigslist process, it’s better just to spread the word with friends and family that you are selling your car. For example, I was thinking about getting a Viper but I had to get rid of a Z06 (with 120k miles). So I put a post up on Facebook, and told a few friends. Word travels fast, and it was sold in 2 weeks to a friend of a friend for $15k.

spyderman4g63 > jjhats
07/19/2015 at 15:09

No but a v6 mustang is one of the most common cars on the road. Supply and demand. The used car supply on these is high.

Steve in Manhattan > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 15:10

I have a Ford story for you as well. But first:

Graduated from college (finally) in my early 30s (1993). Was going to law school in a year, so I got rid of my second (long story) car. I forget what we paid, but someone came to the door with cash on Day 1. $11,000 (full asking) for my ‘91 CRX Si with about 12K on it. It was in perfect shape, and I’d like to believe it is still out there, unmolested.

A year later - ready to go to law school. My DD was an ‘88 Camry wagon 5M - Toyota rebuilt the transmission (their bad) and it had a new clutch that I paid for. I recall maybe 89K on it. I think it was valued at around $6,800. Day 1 - a couple Hispanic day laborers showed up with 7K in cash just to make sure they got it (there were maybe 20 phone calls after that). I had to insist they take it for a test drive - they didn’t even want that. I disclosed that it had lost a contest with a deer and the front end had been rebuilt by the dealer (I knew a guy) - they didn’t care. I’m sure it’s still running somewhere - that was one tough little car.

The year was 2001, and I was about to move to Manhattan after losing a job in DC. The car: a ‘91 Taurus SHO with 98K on it. It was in outstanding shape aside from a bit of body damage on the side that had been expertly repaired. All the service was done at the dealer (I knew another guy) and it was only given the finest Mobil 1 t0 eat. It’s one flaw was a cloth interior - most of the fan boys wanted leather. I was a vegetarian at the time, so I was pleased that I didn’t have to explain a leather interior. The book said 11 something, so I put it in the paper at 10 grand.

Nothing.

Placed the ad again, this time I think at $9800.

Nothing.

Placed the ad again, $8,900.

One knucklehead called and asked if I’d take 5K for it. I hung up.

Off to CarMax. $6,800 dollars later I felt lucky. But I’d wised up. Part of the money served as a security deposit for the apartment I still live in today.

I feel for you man.

Quade > Squid
07/19/2015 at 15:12

I’d get a decent sale by listing at $12,500 and letting people know that I would negotiate on price and take the first $10k cash offer.

If 10’s what you wanted, you should have listed it at 10.5 or 11. I won’t even respond to an ad where I think the spread between want and ask is too wide. Most people would be considered low-ballers for offering 10 on a 12.5K ask.

spyderman4g63 > timgray
07/19/2015 at 15:14

I don’t know there is a big difference between the cars that fall into the good range. Think my car falls into “good” I’ve seen many that would fall into ibn “good” that have never had the engine detailed.

NoneOfYourBiz > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 15:20

Fantastic post. This one should be over on Jalop’, it’s that good. Kudos for being so brutally honest with yourself and sharing publicly. A lot of people could benefit from your story.

I tell people this all the time. If you modify a car, you will not only not get the money out of it that you spent on the modification, it will reduce the value of your car by that much or more. Bone stock all the way unless you never expect to sell for more than scrap.

In the end, I had no choice but to swallow my pride and sell my car for $7500. I suppose I could’ve kept my car for longer but then again I didn’t want to hold onto the car anymore and run the risk of having to pay for more unexpected repairs.

There’s an accounting term called “present value” that loosely relates to this. The carrying cost of an item (such as the cost of the blown alternator, ongoing maintenance, storage etc) has to be taken into account; often you’re better to just sell today at a discount than hold out for more.

When I’m selling cars, I often do this:

list at 10 or 20% higher than fair market

tell potential buyers if they bring cash, today, I’m willing to discount

also tell them that I have other interested parties and I will hold out for other offers if they don’t take it

That way, there’s pressure on the buyer (“putting the pen in their hand, always be closing” etc) to act now.

AthomSfere > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 15:22

I have to say too:

Used Mustang. They are everywhere, in every trim level. I couldn’t count the times I have wandered onto a lot and had the salesmen essentially trying to give me a used Mustang. It is one of those cars every lot has at least one of in several different price brackets.

Even the 2015s are already on the used market!

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/…

Xraided > Tina Corbett
07/19/2015 at 15:24

Lol im not the only jalop that loved the pos family beater, my 02 has 286000 and no overdrive but i drive everywhere, at sixty mph.

rgt881 > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 15:24

Outstanding article. I am forever thankful for not doing any mods to my car, short of doing a euro drop on the gti and replacing mirror covers with those from Audi RS line. Anyway, when it comes to KBB best thing to do is to go off of the dealer trade in value as the private party retail value.

it is important to know the competition. Not just same model, but know you have working against you the low interest rates, 7 year terms, new car discounts, lease offers, plus cars coming off of leases. This is our competition. Economy is still shit and only generous deals will win. Moral of the story is: be generous and greedy just the right amount. It’s a balance.

j250ex > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 15:32

Recently finished selling my car and then my dads right after. Few things I learned. Pictures are important. Cleaned both cars till my fingers were dull. Looked at values on auto trader and kbb. Got a good idea of what the cars were bringing and priced accordingly. The hardest part is shuffling through the tire kickers and low ballers. I still entertain their calls because you never know. It’s difficult but eventually they will sell. Just like the author said you have to be realistic on price. If a buyer comes offering .85% of your asking price do you take it? Sure you can hold out for more money and who knows maybe someone will offer more but I’d rather have guarantee than the possibility of maybe another $1,000.

Chemistropath > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 15:34

Above 100k it’s about mileage not years. Last year I bought a Jag XK8 (list price when new: 78,000), perfect condition in California with 114k on the clock for 7k. A car is always worth what the market will pay and not $0.01 more.

askyar > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 15:38

I had a POS new beetle with 150k miles. Listed it for $1800 in the hopes of getting an offer a bit south of $1500 and getting rid of it. I had a few no-shows at that price point, but the only real couple of offers I got were in the $1200 category, which I ignored. Then came the fun part. In the process of waiting the motor mounts broke, the hood latch broke (yes seriously a hood latch can break on the POS because it’s made of plastic). Winter set in and the non-functional blower which was a mere annoyance before now became a serious road hazard, because you couldn’t defrost the windshield anymore.

I ended up selling the car for $800 , after paying maybe $100 in insurance between the first $1200 offer and the time I sold it.

t3itguy > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 15:38

Where on earth did you spend $600 for an alternator? Mine went out at around 70k (diodes fried), and it was $180 from AutoZone with an $11 core charge. Took about 15 minutes to change in the parking lot.

Hector P. Malawicz Jr. > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 15:43

You did all the cleaning and polishing for the dealer and now they have it listed for $12.5k. You may have been rooked, dude.

http://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventory…

v8RWD4doorSTICK > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 15:43

Ha, I have a sickness, im always looking at cars to buy on cars.com, craigslist...ect.

On average, i replace a car once a year, i dont have to, so i only buy when its a good deal and if i get a feally good deal on my car, for the past 5 years, i’ve averaged 1000 in depreciation over a year. Thats not to bad if you spread that over 12 months, its less than 100 a month to own the car for a year. My best was a brand new dpcus st that i only lost 200 on depreciation over 18 months.

Point being though, i always see privately owned cars waaaaay over priced because of the owners sentimental feelings towards the car. Before even reading your article, i was going to say you put it up for 12k and would aettle for 10k but got no bites.

Ive learned that there is a fine line between making money selling privately and just trading in. Especially in some states like nj. Just to make round numbers, say i fot 20k for my focus st, nj says i dont have to pay tax on that amount towards a new car. New car cost 30k.

Trading in i pay 30700 with 7% sales tax

say selling privately i actually get 20k, i pay sales tax on the entire 30k.

that would be 32100, quite a diff, i would have to sell my car for 21400 just to break even.

Dream Theater of the Absurd > Tina Corbett
07/19/2015 at 15:51

I’ve given away one car in my entire life - my ‘82 Audi Coupe. But that car was such a piece of junk that I couldn’t sell it in good conscience. I wound up donating it.

DayWooTang > spyderman4g63
07/19/2015 at 15:55

Looks to be a GT from the pics.

Rykros the Disdainful - Supposed Petulant Capitulant Junkie > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 16:13

First mistake: It’s a Mustang. There’s so many of them out there, and it’s a mainstream car. With any trim, with any engine. It’s not going to fetch anything close to a top-market premium price unless it’s a desireable limited-edition trim of somesuch.

With that being said, I’m going to be feeling the sting myself, soon. Ultimately decided to keep our van instead of our Subaru. Subaru will sell for less money here (’Murica land prefers Domestics), but more money in California (Subaru + very little rust for a Michigan-owned car).

Van will sell for more money HERE (in great condition with generous, desireable equipment for all the suburban families in the area) and be worth basically diddly squat in California (domestic vehicle + midwest van with some rust).

The full background story aside, keeping the van is more practical than the cash value of either vehicle would suggest, and at this point I may as well keep the [well-maintained] van until the wheels fall off. As it won’t be worth jack shit out there anyway.

E92M3 > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 16:14

Next time try autotrader. I know it costs $45, but it’s a different crowd. Craigslisters all think they are going to make a living flipping cars. They are all searching for a deal. That little old lady selling her husbands air cooled porsche for $10k because that’s what he paid for it 20 years ago. That deal will never happen so they begin lowballing 20 people a day without even seeing the cars, hoping 1 will take their ridiculous offer. Next time do us all a favor and agree to their offer, but give them an address of a vacant house to go to.

C-Rod > Squid
07/19/2015 at 16:16

Here in the South you can sell a Taco in no time, they are very desirable and hold their price well.

Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 16:18

Craigslist has “the clock.” If your ad has been up long enough, or posted mutiple times, the assumption is that there is something wrong with it. If you don’t sell within the first week, you’re screwed. If you lower your price, that also signals to the searcher that you are desperate and were not forthcoming with condition or quality in your original post.

After what I’m selling sits for too long (over 2 weeks), I just sell it to the next person who makes an offer and cleanse my life of the burden.

PG; the scalpel wielder > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 16:24

Kinja'd!!!

I just went through the same thing. Was chasing too much and over posted. My ad was everywhere and way too wordy. I used a lot of Facebook groups which annoyed my friends with notifications. After 6 weeks I finally sold it from my starting price of 17k for 14k. It was valued at 10 to 11k but had about 4k of mods on used market. I think I did ok, but I feel bad with how I got there...

Squid > Quade
07/19/2015 at 16:45

Well, we wanted $12.5, but were willing to take a serious cash deal at $10k. That was the absolute bottom end and people were offering around 6.5-7 because they were dealers trying to lowball the shit out of me. We eventually got the truck sold at I think 10.5 or $11 but I can’t remember. It just took a long time.

Squid > C-Rod
07/19/2015 at 16:47

Yeah, I think the 4x4 is actually what held up that sale. If it were the Preruner It probably would have sold quite quickly.

Mike Villa > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 17:31

This is basically exactly what happened when I sold my M Roadster (Z3). Things kept on breaking, offers kept getting lower and lower.

Looking back on it I should’ve either 1. kept it, or 2. sold it immediately. Either option would’ve saved me thousands.

thatsmr > MooseKnuckles
07/19/2015 at 17:33

Keep in mind there is so much markup and dealer cash in domestic trucks, they could have "showed" you even more for the Mazda. They wholesaled it for the real market price and still made a couple grand on the Silverado....

signinsrlame > Tina Corbett
07/19/2015 at 17:40

yes, yes, yes and yes. I think he wrote this tongue in cheek, but jesus christ I wish I could have you with me the next time I look for a used Tacoma :)

OmerCarrothers333 > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 17:45

This sounds very familiar, I’m not in the market for a car, but I do like to look at what’s out there.

I decided to see what the market was for Subaru Imprezas in the Salt Lake City area. I found one online from a private owner, it’s a mid-2000s Subaru Impreza with 92,000 miles, and he’s asking for $10k. In his ad he states he doesn’t care what the car is worth, it’s his baby and he wants $10k, he’s put a lot of work into the car and feels that it’s worth $10k due to putting in a new stereo and getting new rims.

I thought to myself “Good luck selling your car, dumbass.”

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > jjhats
07/19/2015 at 18:38

Ironically, ours was also a Ford. Nice try though.

Junker_CM > boxrocket
07/19/2015 at 18:45

I’ll give you a pack of gum and a reach around for it!

Longanissa > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 18:51

Luckily here in Houston we have Texas Direct Auto, an ebay seller. This year bought my 2005 GT Automatic with 88k miles for $9k. The only problem is every new car dealer in town knows Texas Direct Auto is everyones “backstop” so you won’t get anything more than that.

bobrayner > Tina Corbett
07/19/2015 at 18:51

Your car is only worth what people are willing to pay for it. Not what you paid for it, not what a computer says, not what your buddy says, and NOT what you ‘put into it’.

Truth.

Apex Assassin > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 18:53

$7500 for that Mustang is still top dollar... especially considering it was built with the cheapest garbage parts FoMoCo could find.

AthomSfere > sm70- why not Duesenberg?
07/19/2015 at 18:55

Wasn’t it a Flex? Where like 5 were ever actually sold? (I like the Flex!)

But outside those, and a rare few others Ford’s hold no value and sell in such volumes...

Jim > Torque Affair
07/19/2015 at 19:12

These stories are exactly why I save myself the heartache, headache, and ulcer by just trading/selling my cars to a dealer. Yeah, I may take it in the shorts for a few dollars, but I still have hair and I don’t puke blood.

Kyree S. Williams > spyderman4g63
07/19/2015 at 19:18

As it is for virtually any Chrysler vehicle, except the Grand Cherokee, which is why I would never buy one new.

JQJ213- Now With An Extra Cylinder! > Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo
07/19/2015 at 19:22

Yep. Thats what happened with my V70R

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > AthomSfere
07/19/2015 at 19:30

It was, and they are everywhere.

jjhats > spyderman4g63
07/19/2015 at 19:44

except that this one is a v8 with a manual. arguably the more popular and hence should be worth more than a v6. its still a ford though and supply is high so demand is low